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Post Info TOPIC: Regional Competition
Anonymous

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Regional Competition
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Hello,


Vinay here.  I just have a few questions for quincy (and possibly Sam) concerning regional UIL.


I know you take the number sense Dr. Numsen tests, especially Medium level.  I take these too, and so I just want to know how hard the regional test is compared to the Medium level tests.


Second, what score is needed to advance in the UIL to state?  I'm in 5A, district 4...


third, if I study the invitational A and B tests, should I expect to encounter any new problems or surprises on the regional test?


Thanks a lot,


Vinay



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Sam


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First, I have no clue as to the difficulty of the test.  The test will definately be harder than district.  Look for a hard first column.  Make sure to read carefully.  For example, last year a question was in the format:


Find the sum of the roots of x^3 - 4x + 1 = 0   


Since there is no x^2, or b, term, the answer is 0.


As far as what score will advance you to state, I still have no idea.  Nerve tends to play a huge factor at the higher levels of competition.  The main thing is to stay calm on the first column; this will help settle some of the initial nerve.



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Bah! I missed that question on last year's test.  Congrats Sam on being the only 4A student to break 300.  I wish we were still in the same region (not really now that I think about it).  You've come a long way from your 170ish something last year at regionals and even farther from your double digits before that.  I thought this year's district was harder than previous years.  I went in expecting an easy 300, but failed.  Eh, my region is the lowest scoring in 4A in my opinion, so I should make it to state in 3 tests (NS, MA, CS).  I'm hoping to make it into top 3 number sense, but we'll see.  Did you qualify in any other tests?


 



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Anonymous

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Don't know if you were asking just sam or everyone, so I'll just respond anyway...


I placed first in Mathematics with a 264.


Vinay



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Hey Vinay


Sam is right, the regional test will be alot harder than the district test, i remember last yr no one broke 300 in regionals and only a few broke 200. i agree with Sam about the strategy. Which is to slow down, read the problems carefully, and try to be as accurate as you can. Expect a long 1st pg, which may even take you 4 or 5 min, but i still think it is better to slow down. Don't worry about how far you get, instead, focus on how accurate you can be. Think about this: if you only get to problem 50, but you don't miss any, you get a 250, which i am sure is more than enough to get you to state. And i just check pretty much all the scores in ur region, i think 250 - 270 should be enough to get you to state (Lubbock has some good scores). Now, instead of analyzing those invitationals, i think it is better choice to analyze the two district tests.


good luck


quincy



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Well Vinay, I've seen the regional tests from last year, and they are a little more difficult than the medium Dr. Numsense test because they assume you know how to deal with the more difficult variations of the types of questions you see at district and the invite tests. The district test was surprisingly easy, so I guess the regional test will be at least more tedious. The way it worked last year was that region was more difficult than state. Get a 230 and you're into state in any region in 4A. I think the lowest score that got in was I'd guess that'd be an equivalent to a 260 or so on an easier test. Good luck V.

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Sorry. That came out wrong. Lowest 3rd place score was around a 160. A 230 at region is like a 260 or so on the medium Dr. numsense tests.

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Im going to regionals in #sense, calculator apps., and math, but i don't really have as much competition as all of you guys (2A).  I think i have a good chance at going to state in # sense, but it's gonna take some more studying.

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Sam


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Thanks, Michael.  Good luck on the triple crown (CS,NS,Math).  I'm going to miss our old region too.  I think the first time is always a little more special.  Anyways, hope to see you soon.


P.S. Orry Swift from Dayton (19-4A) got a 318 in case you hadn't heard. 



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Sam


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Oh yeah, I'm also going in accounting (don't ask how) and probably math (via wildcard).

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Anonymous

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Ya, he was a late entry into the results.  It'll be interesting to see how region plays out.  It's good to have all of the cards on the table though and see who the competition is.  I've set my goal as 1st comp sci and placing in numsen and math at state, but I'll definitly have to work on every test to achieve that.

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1st in CS? What school do you go to? How big is it? If you're looking for a 1st in 4A comp sci, you'll have to beat our giant from Dripping Springs. He scores a consistantly perfect score, and he's only getting better. He beat the state champ from last year at district (240 to 202) Beware!  He's advancing in 3 events as well, (NS, CS, and Math) Good luck to you, and your pursuit of the crown.   



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Anonymous

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Ha, ya I said it would be tough, but definitly possible.  I REALLY hope the state level test features crazy hard questions, but that's near impossible with how the test is set up.  There's a one page list of all the topics that you have to know (about 20?), and each one can be quickly understood and mastered.  I enjoy tests at invitiationals (some of the harder Scroggs tests) that actually test you understanding of the implementation of Java, rather than mindless data recall.  If as many students did comp sci as math then they would have to make the tests harder because there would be dozens of people making perfect scores.  I HATE that!  I think I'll start practicing for the comp sci test, but there's not too much room to take down a perfect score!  I'm going to a programming contest with him this weekend at UNT. 


Side Note: If anyone here programs, you HAVE to do TCEA stuff.  It's extremely fun.  The problems are too easy and kind of random, but just like a UIL event they are under extreme time constraints so that's what sets people apart.  I enjoy USACO even more because you have to have a good understanding of standard algorithms and even more creativity to alter them.  It's applied creative math is all it is. 


Does anyone else think it would be a good idea to make a separate UIL event, possibly called Advanced Topics, that is something like a 20 question 2-hour test that requires high-level problem solving skills similar to the AIME?  UIL is great, but problem-solving higher level thinking tests are so much more interesting. 



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Anonymous

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Oh, and I go to 15-4A Midlothian.  Don't worry, the city won't strike any fear into any CS contestant's soul until after TCEA state.

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Midlothian, eh? I think I've heard of you. I myself do comp sci, but this year I had some previous obligations in Social Studies to take care of, (much more work... sigh*) and so I am going to region in only NS and SS. I took the district 2 test for comp sci anyway and got a 186. I am probably the schools second best programmer, but I havent had the time to participate in anything other than UIL. I'm taking the Best of Texas CS tests and am currently in 3rd, behind Robby and some Waller kid. I guess its pretty good for a sophamore, especially one who taught himself Java in two weeks.


Are you competing in the O(CS)squared contest this saturday? If you are, you'll see Robby there. You cant miss him, he's the kid that resembles Jesus who is making up his own one man team. Good luck. He's pretty good.  


I havent taken any variation of the AIME since my glorious middle school days... I've looked into the contest, and I must say that it is very intriguing. I have never taken it... How do you sign up? Do you have to be nominated or do you just have to get your schools approval?   


With respect to the simplicity of the UIL CS tests I agree with you 100%. I took the state test from last year and I would have scored a 192, given that I did not choke at the contest. I'd say that the difficulty of the test mirrors the difficulty of the math test, the only difference is that the CS test goes by much faster. If it were longer, (like 60 questions in 55 minutes) I'd think that it would be a bit more challenging. 


Have you taken the hexco CS tests? They are a mockery of CS if you ask me. 40 useless programs performing meaningless tasks, with tedius overhead every other line of command. I took a hexco test in San Antonio a few months ago and it was very disappointing. I got through only 26 questions and got a 146. I fealt so bad after that test... Robby only got second at the meet. He was outscored by some guy from La Joya high school named Oscar. hahhaha! Oscar de la Joya!


Good luck to you at region man!



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A 186 is very good for 4A, especially for someone who learned Java in 2 weeks. 5A is MUCH more competitive with 30+ scores 200 or higher, where 4A has 6. What are the Best of Texas CS tests? havent heard of them...

Ya it's the O(CS)^2. Has he ever done any onsite programming? I didn't see dripping springs in TCEA. Inform him about USACO for me, It's less popular than it's worth.

To qualify for the AIME, you must either be in the top 5% of the AMC 12 or the top 1% of the AMC 10. It's not too difficult to accomplish, but you should visit their website and get familiar with the tests. Everybody who's anybody in math competitions should take the AMC's.

Bahah! Oscar de La Joya... No I've never taken any Hexco. The hardest written test I've taken was at the first programming contest I went to which was earlier this year. It'll be interesting to see the difficult of UNT's tests. I just hate the questions that you have to traverse endless code for no apparent reason. Though, a big part of coding is learning how to understand endless code.

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What is USACO? I've never heard of it.


Is there a contest from AMC for Juniors? I guess I missed the boat this year for the AMC 10, but I saw some of their previous tests, and they dont seem that hard at all. What kind of score would you need to advance in that competition?


Robby, if I may speak for him, has never done any onsite programming, but I understand that the process is relatively simple, so he should do well. He said that he looked at a practice test and he got all but one. As for the programming part, he was able to do all but one program in the allotted time, and I believe it was a calculator implementation. He plans to bring his C++ book to the contest because it has almost nothing but contest type implementations ripe for the stealing. By the way, he's only a sophamore (he wont be here next year though, he's going to TAMS).


The best of texas series tests make up a league in which you take the sums of the 5 tests the send your school in the mail, and the one with the greatest score obviously wins. They divide the state up by grade level and school size. I have looked everywhere on the internet for the source, but I have no idea who makes them (They are much like the scroggs tests, except not as accurate). Evidently they also make bio tests as well. I seriously dont know who makes them though.


And one last thing...


What are the UNT's? I havent heard of them either...  



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I'm going as a back-up for accounting too.  So, if I don't qualify for state by individually, i have a good chance of just tagging along with the accounting team.  That's cool that you're in accounting too Sam.  What kind of scores are the 4A'ers making?

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USACO is the premier national high school programming contest which has a much different format than most contests.  It's generally 3 programs in 3-5 hours that stress algorithmic creativity rather than just a knowledge of your language and the ability to write bug-free code quickly.  You take it over the internet (generally just at your house).  Visit ace.delos.com/usacogate for training problems, or www.usaco.org for their website.  There's about 6 competitions throughout they year, one being the US Open.  The Open is on April 28th this year, so it may be too late for you or Robby to prepare if you have no previous algorithmic experience (working knowledge of Djkistra, Prim's, Kruskal's, Network Flow algorithms, Dynamic Programming, etc.).   


AMC 12 is for juniors and seniors.  It's actually the one that I took this year because I find it easier to make it in that test than the 10 (top 5% rather than top 1%).  If you're decent at UIL math you should be able to do the first 15.  It's +6 for a correct answer and +2.5 for a skipped question, so 15 right and 10 skipped would give you a 112.5, which was my score this year.  You need a 100+ to qualify for sure. 


Will Robby be programming in C++ this weekend?  I would, but my teammates only know Java, so I would feel bad using C++ and leaving them just sitting there for 2 hours.  I thought about going to TAMS, but I did a visiting weekend and wasn't too impressed, so I didn't.  I, too, would have gone with CS as my major focus, but TAMS seems to stress the physical sciences too much for my taste. 


Do you have a website for Best of Texas?


By the UNT test, I meant the test we'll be taking this weekend at UNT.  It's the UNT ACM programming contest. 



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Hello, Michael. This is Robby.

I'll certainly look into USACO, since it seems I won't be in UIL next year. It will be nice to have a contest that requires some advanced knowledge, even if I haven't yet acquired it. Could you provide a link to the AMC contest site?

This Saturday, only Java is allowed. Horrible, isn't it? I personally don't mind; my knowledge of C++ is pitiful compared to what I know about Java. I think the freedom of C++ would make contests like O(CS)^2 easier, but it would become cumbersome and almost nightmarish compared to Java's artificial grace when it comes to more complex problems.

On the written tests, I completely agree with you. When the most difficult problems on the test involve a method that returns the number of times an array can be divided by the first element, then repopulated with elements equally distributed throughout the old one, something is seriously wrong. Not only does it expose the limits of the concepts in the contest, it also makes the contest seem trivial. Having said that, I thought the district 2 test was less strangely useless than usual.

I look forward to meeting you on Saturday, and at the state meet. However, I do not plan on taking second place in either. Good luck.

-- Edited by sharpobject at 17:19, 2005-04-06

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